Yall said no...Wildrose dvd said yes???

[Warren]

When I asked could you use skeet shooting as a little training on being steady to the gun all of the responses where no don't do it. I was watching a wildrose dvd sunday and they do that very thing. Had dog at hill and shot about 6 times then moved to different locations and shot. He said shoot 12-15 times then shoot and throw a bumber. 1 retrieve for 12-15 no retrieves. What is everyone's oppinion on this? I still don't know

[quakwacker]

I don't see anything wrong with it as long as you do throw a bumper after a shot every now and then.

[goosebruce]

Teach a dog to sit, vrs boring one into sitting. travis

[B3]

The WR approach is very different in many areas. It can be difficult to mix their approach with the collar based ones especially if youre new at this. I personally like some aspects of the skeet shooting drill because if the dog breaks theirs nothing there to reward him. It goes along with their less force based approach. Rather than putting him in a situation to break to get the opportunity to correct him, you teach the dog that he will find something only if you send him.

If you use a force based approach then this drill like GB says would be less beneficial. In the last couple of dogs I've trained FF style I've not seen much benefit, in the dogs trained "their" way I think it has more of a point than boring them to death.

Bill

[dukdawgn]

you have to look at what you are trying to teach...

Are you trying to teach steadiness b/c the dog breaks when a gun goes off, or are you trying to teach steadiness b/c the dog breaks when a duck flies through the air??

I'll wager its b/c the dog likes ducks, not gun powder. You'd be better off getting a few live birds on a rope and enforcing behavior from there.

[Warren]

thanks guys I like the idea of the ducks on a rope he does that too just need to find some thats all

[Troy Williams]

There is absolutely nothing wrong with taking your dog to shoot skeet. He will learn very quickly what's going on. Dogs are very contextual beings. They know when they are training. They know when they are hunting and they know when they are at trials. Your dog will eventually and quickly know that he is at some bang-fest skeet shoot different from testing, training, trialing, hunting or whatever and be a better dog for it.

Don't sweat it much. Take him with you...if he is a good dog and minds his manners then great....If he is not a well mannered dog use it for disicipline and teach him some manners (being mindful of others of course-They came to shoot skeet & probably not to train your dog). If it's a pain to deal with and he gets himself in trouble then put the dog up. Do what makes you both happy but be smart about it.

KEEP him out of muzzle blast area. Save those ears!!!

Have fun-
T-Roy

[goosebruce]

the problem arises when folks use that as their intorduction to gun fire. the intro to gunfire should have a dog ampped when he hears a gun. take a dog not amped, and shoot a couple hundred rounds with no benefit, and then add a sit correction or two in the middle of it, welp, then you got you some issues. travis (who still see no benefit, but could very easliy cause a problem, but doesnt skeet shoot anymore cause hes always training dogs)

[Warren]

I never said I was going to use this as a introduction to gunfire. She has no problem whatsoever with a gun. I was just thinking of doing it for a steady drill. She is steady now w/o a gun but when you bring a gun in to it sometimes she wants to break. There is no big issue here just thought that I would work this into her training somehow.

[Troy Williams]

I never said I was going to use this as a introduction to gunfire. She has no problem whatsoever with a gun. I was just thinking of doing it for a steady drill. She is steady now w/o a gun but when you bring a gun in to it sometimes she wants to break. There is no big issue here just thought that I would work this into her training somehow.

Like i said...That should be no problem. Dog should figure it out very quickly. I always took my dogs everywhere we went. Horse shows, fishing, squirrel hunting...You name it. A much better dog for it I'm sure.

Have fun and make sure your dog has fun too!!!!!!

Troy

[Troy Williams]

I know a HT trainer in Tx that starts puppies for some of the biggest name FT'ers known. She takes them everywhere; grocery store, you name it. They go to the field everyday and they get the run of the place. They will chase the big dogs on their marks. Follow the big dogs when they run blinds, etc. etc..... Bite their ears when on the line, all that. Both dogs, big and the puppies, are much the better for it.

Troy

[GulfCoast]

Interesting, more from Mike Stewart:

The most common causes of gunshyness are man made and usually completely avoidable.


Someone other than the owner does something stupid to the pup making them fearful of the "bang" such as a neighborhood kid tossing fireworks close to the pup.


The owner does something stupid to the pup. A new Wildrose training law now takes shape. I've given you several over the years and I hope you are keeping up … add this one to your list: "Stupid hurts."

Commit a stupid act with your pup/dog and it will come back to haunt you. Here is a list of "stupid" or shall I be more politically correct by saying "avoidable" considerations concerning gunfire introduction.


Test firing: firing a shot over an unsuspecting pup or even started dog to see if the younger shows signs of fear. I know where I'll put my money.


Associating potential gunshyness with a dog's fear of thunder, mowers or weed eaters. There is no correlation. Many fine hunting dogs fear thunderstorms.


Taking a young pup on a hunt for "experience." This has the makings for real trouble.


Discharging a shot behind an unsuspecting pup as they eat. Logical? Try shooting behind a 3-year old kid as they partake in a breakfast of Cocoa Puffs … bet the kid (and his mom, too) won't give you a desirable response. Likely the pup won't either. Gunfire should be associated with birds, not eating … no surprises.


Opening up over a young dog on their first hunt with several 3-inch magnums at dawn. Even if introduced to the shotgun, this loud shot intensity may be too much.


Taking a young pup to a sport shooting or rifle range for introductory purposes.

[goosebruce]

Never said it was your introduction. but always remember when something is written on the net, it will be read many many times, by many many people. And you can bet someone will take their dog to the skeet range cause they read on the internet it was a good way to see if their dog was gunshy. they're are already people who think thats a good ideal, in fact id say the majority of people who get a new pup dont introduce gunfire the right way, and its surprising how few dogs actually do end up having problems with it. Guess my point is, and still is, I see no benefit and can still see the potienal harm, so Id still not do it, nor reccomend it publicly. I do agree with troy to take a young pup (with all shots) everywhere you possibly can. but the 45 minutes to shoot a round of skeet isnt going to make or break him socializtion-wise, so i think Id leave him in the shade a long way from the gunfire.

[Warren]

got ya so what are some good drills on teaching steady to the gun.

[Bayou Beagle]

got ya so what are some good drills on teaching steady to the gun.

You'll be surprised how steady your dog is when its just him marking. Put anther dog in the mix and look out.

If you have buddies, we ran a W drill, where the mark is thrown on the left side of the W (dogs and peoples staggered on the points of the W) and the back dog went past the other dogs to retrieve the bird. Then you rotated back.

I'm sure there's a formal name, but can't think of it.

Jeff