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Do you think dogs flare ducks?
Posted: Mon Jan 09, 2006 9:01 pm
by Wingman
I've seen all of the dog blinds and gadgets on the market, but I've also seen ducks land beside dogs and geese change course to follow a dog in the early morning light.
But this afternoon as I passed by a large brake, I noticed several hundred mallard and gadwall sitting not 10 yards from the water's edge. And there, in an opening, were 3 or 4 dogs walking along the bank. The ducks never moved, heck, they didn't even have their necks up but seemed to be quite content. I even laughed as one orange looking dog sat down by the water only 20 or 30 feet from the birds and watched them intently.
Makes me wonder do you really need to hide your dog when you hunt?

Posted: Mon Jan 09, 2006 9:10 pm
by rustypjr
I have seen ducks land not ten feet from where the dog was stretching his legs
Posted: Mon Jan 09, 2006 9:15 pm
by Don Miller
Wingman, Have you ever heard of a type dog called a Nova Scotia Duck Toler?
Posted: Mon Jan 09, 2006 9:35 pm
by bigbeeducker
Don Miller wrote:Wingman, Have you ever heard of a type dog called a Nova Scotia Duck Toler?
They were actually used to lure ducks into shotgun range. Its kinda the same thing as when ducks will dive down into the dekes when your dog is out swimmin. Espescially when its not real light out.
Posted: Mon Jan 09, 2006 9:51 pm
by Dr. B
Ah, yeah. I've seen them scare ducks. Take Sunday afternoon for example. We've got a group of 8 greenheads and 2 susies working the decoys. Making pass after pass getting lower each time. Trying to land but the wind was making it hard for them. They'd pull up, circle the blind and come back and try it again. Finally, they were sitting there, hovering over the dekes about 10 feet off the water trying to get in the hole but about 10 yards too far yet. We're sitting there, safeties off, ready to cut them and the damn dog breaks and sloshes out to the ducks as they are sitting over the dekes. Of course the ducks flare and we empty our guns and didn't cut a feather. That was one very lucky dog not to have is ass full of hevi shot. But lesson learned, he spent the rest of the afternoon leashed up until he went to make a retrive. Which he did a piss poor job of that as well. Ran right by a teal and slam out of sight into dry corn 100 yards away. The wind pushed the duck out of sight and we lost that one. That was about typical for my hunt Sunday.
Dr. B
Montgomery
Posted: Mon Jan 09, 2006 9:54 pm
by Wingman
I never knew this until y'all mentioned the breed; pretty neat!
Tolling retriever gaining popularity
Up until about 64 years ago, the Little River Duck Toller, which has since been renamed the Nova Scotia Duck Tolling Retriever and commonly called the "toller," was a well-guarded secret in the Nova Scotia area.
It began its development in the Little River district of Yarmouth County, Nova Scotia during the 1800s, around the same time as other popular retrieving breeds like the Labrador, golden and Chesapeake were being developed.
The toller didn't gain the popularity of the aforementioned breeds because the original breeders didn't allow females to leave their kennels. These Canadian breeders were avid duck hunters who didn't want competition on the lakes and marshes, so they kept their dogs under lock and key.
Bred to resemble the red fox, it's also playful and intelligent with hunting instincts and retrieving ability. And males top out at 50 pounds, which is considerably smaller than the other retrieving breeds.
But why breed a duck dog to look like a predator, which would almost surely scare ducks away? Sounds impossible, but just the opposite is true.
The toler tolls ducks, which means to lure or entice. The idea of using a dog to toll ducks wasn't new. It can be traced as far back as 1625 when dogs were used to lure flocks of ducks into large nets.
And to breed a dog to look like a fox, the success would surely increase. It has to do with the predator/prey relationship where a swallow will approach a crow, and a crow approaches an owl.
"When ducks see a fox on the water's edge, they will approach it in much the same way," said Doug Coldwell of Delhaven, Nova Scotia. Coldwell is a breeder, trainer and handler of champion tollers, and is author of the book, "The Love of Tollers."
"It's unknown whether they do it to tease or drive off the intruder, but ducks will toll from great distances and often come in hissing and threatening the fox or toller," he continued.
"The hunters stay in the blind and send the dog out. The dog plays and jumps along the water's edge and the ducks toll in. The hunters keep the dog playing by throwing it sticks."
When the ducks are tolled into range by the dog's playful antics, the hunters then can flush and shoot the ducks. The dog then goes out, often in icy water, and retrieves the dead ducks.
"Almost any dog will toll ducks, but the toller does it better because it looks like the fox. It was kept a secret because it's such a deadly technique," Doug said.
But in the autumn of 1936, Babe Ruth, who was a regular fishing and hunting guest in Yarmouth, Nova Scotia, was introduced to the toller on a duck hunting trip. He was so impressed with the unique retriever, that he brought one back to the United States. They caught on some, but really gained popularity in the last 10 years or so.
Sue Phillips of New Bedford owns a toller she bought from Coldwell. The dog is BISS CH Little River's Delhaven Dancer, or "The Dancer" for short. He won the Novia Scotia National Specialty in 1999.
"My husband, Mike, and I, learned of the tollers while on a trip to Nova Scotia," Sue said. "We had seen a big sign with a picture of a toller on it, and it was billed as Nova Scotia's provincial dog. It was beautiful and we had talked about getting another dog, so we looked into them."
"We bought The Dancer as a two-year old and we just love him. He's got a great personality and is very gentle around children. He knows how to lick our grandchildren's feet to make them giggle. He's a house or apartment-size dog and he's very protective of the home and family."
Tollers cost a little more than labs or goldens and you can expect to pay $700 on up for a pet-quality pup.
"They're really a multi-purpose hunter," added Doug. "They decoy ducks and then retrieve them. They're hearty and tough with great stamina and they've also got keen noses which are sensitive enough for upland bird hunting like pheasants, partridge and quail."
Doug and his wife, Dawn, are visiting from Canada this weekend to attend the Nova Scotia Duck Tolling Retriever Club U.S.A. Hunt Test. It's the national championship for tollers which is being hosted in Southeastern Massachusetts this year where Doug is handling and showing The Dancer.
A record number of tollers, owners and handlers have travelled from across the country and Canada to attend this event.
One segment of the competition is the conformation, where dogs are judged on how much they resemble a fox and their movements. This was held in Seekonk
Today is the hunt test, which begins at 8:30 a.m. across from the Bayside Restaurant on Horeseneck Road in Westport. Here, the dogs are judged on how well they work rather than look. They are scored on how well they toll ducks and how they retrieve. It's for whom the ducks toll that decides the winners.
Marc Folco is a columnist for the Standard-Times.
Posted: Mon Jan 09, 2006 10:02 pm
by Don Miller
Thanks for posting Wingman. I had a nieghbor that had one when I was a kid some 20 something years ago. I remember the name because I always called the dog a Nova Scotia Duck Toter.

He never hunted with the dog. I don't even think that goofy dog would even retrieve.
Posted: Mon Jan 09, 2006 10:30 pm
by cajun squealer
Sounds like the pefect dog for the avid water-swatter!
Canadians, eh?

Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2006 1:03 am
by Dutch Dog
You know they actually have field trials especially for them. I guess it's some sorta competition to see which dog puts on the best "tolling" show, but am not real sure.
Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2006 8:09 am
by Trip
According to Snapp dogs and fourwheelers will flare ducks
Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2006 8:43 am
by DownEast
A good doog won't flare ducks. Good = steady.
Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2006 8:54 am
by Bonehead
DownEast wrote:A good doog won't flare ducks. Good = steady.
agreed.
Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2006 8:54 am
by h2o_dog
A dog swimming in the decoys will attrack ducks.
A whining, creeping dog will flare wary ducks - especially if he's jumping around on treestand as they are making their last pass.
Any and everything will flare skiddish ducks.
Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2006 8:57 am
by h2o_dog
Don Miller wrote:Thanks for posting Wingman. I had a nieghbor that had one when I was a kid some 20 something years ago. I remember the name because I always called the dog a Nova Scotia Duck Toter.

He never hunted with the dog. I don't even think that goofy dog would even retrieve.
I've seen a couple of tolers at AKC hunt tests over the years, but they weren't entered (I don't think AKC recognizes the breed?). The ones I saw would retrieve, but thats about all you could say about their retrieving skills.
Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2006 9:03 am
by Duck Sniper
Bonehead wrote:DownEast wrote:A good doog won't flare ducks. Good = steady.
agreed.
double agreed