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You don't get to be able to react this way from a one day training class. This takes years of both on duty and off duty to be able to produce this type of muscle memory response. I am not sure I would or could have reacted the way he did.

http://www.funkertactical.com/off-duty- ... be-robber/

http://chicago.cbslocal.com/2014/02/12/ ... g-her-son/

Sad deal. We don't know the whole story, but bottom line is the boy's mother doesn't blame the victim (the off-duty cop). That's good to see in the midst of a lose-lose situation.

Smoke68 wrote:http://chicago.cbslocal.com/2014/02/12/mother-of-armed-robber-doesnt-blame-officer-for-shooting-her-son/

Sad deal. We don't know the whole story, but bottom line is the boy's mother doesn't blame the victim (the off-duty cop). That's good to see in the midst of a lose-lose situation.

It is a sad deal no doubt. That a 16 year old is capable of this type of attempted robbery.. I hate that it has to come to this type of situation, but I am afraid that it will only get worse until more and more people start standing up for themselves as this officer did..

cwink wrote:

Smoke68 wrote:http://chicago.cbslocal.com/2014/02/12/mother-of-armed-robber-doesnt-blame-officer-for-shooting-her-son/

Sad deal. We don't know the whole story, but bottom line is the boy's mother doesn't blame the victim (the off-duty cop). That's good to see in the midst of a lose-lose situation.

It is a sad deal no doubt. That a 16 year old is capable of this type of attempted robbery.. I hate that it has to come to this type of situation, but I am afraid that it will only get worse until more and more people start standing up for themselves as this officer did..

Correct, the fear of the person you are robbing having a gun is the only way to stop stuff like this from happening. Chicago has the toughest gun laws in America and a 16y/o kid got his hands on one...its a crying shame

RiverDuck wrote:

cwink wrote:

Smoke68 wrote:http://chicago.cbslocal.com/2014/02/12/mother-of-armed-robber-doesnt-blame-officer-for-shooting-her-son/

Sad deal. We don't know the whole story, but bottom line is the boy's mother doesn't blame the victim (the off-duty cop). That's good to see in the midst of a lose-lose situation.

It is a sad deal no doubt. That a 16 year old is capable of this type of attempted robbery.. I hate that it has to come to this type of situation, but I am afraid that it will only get worse until more and more people start standing up for themselves as this officer did..

Correct, the fear of the person you are robbing having a gun is the only way to stop stuff like this from happening. Chicago has the toughest gun laws in America and a 16y/o kid got his hands on one...its a crying shame

I'd disagree, although I think the police officer acted responsibly.

16 y/o kids aren't the greatest at calculating risk. Fathers becoming involved and the repair of the family unit in the african american culture is pretty much the only way to stop it. And that is only going to happen by the grace of God. Fear of the victim having a gun assumes rational thought in the mind of a 16 yr old criminal, which just isn't there.

Smoke68 wrote:
I'd disagree, although I think the police officer acted responsibly.

16 y/o kids aren't the greatest at calculating risk. Fathers becoming involved and the repair of the family unit in the african american culture is pretty much the only way to stop it. And that is only going to happen by the grace of God. Fear of the victim having a gun assumes rational thought in the mind of a 16 yr old criminal, which just isn't there.

I agree. But, I would have to say that a 16 year old kid is very capable of making a rational thought. The problem is they are just very immature about the decisions they make affecting themselves and those around them.

My statement was really intended for crime of all ages...

Smoke68 wrote:http://chicago.cbslocal.com/2014/02/12/mother-of-armed-robber-doesnt-blame-officer-for-shooting-her-son/

Sad deal. We don't know the whole story, but bottom line is the boy's mother doesn't blame the victim (the off-duty cop). That's good to see in the midst of a lose-lose situation.

Surprised the boy's father wasn't sitting next to his mother in that interview - wait, no I'm not - and that's the main problem.

Chances are the cop didn't know the kid was 16, the only thing he probably saw was the end of that barrel..

As I mentioned before I am not sure I would or could have acted as he did. I think I would have tried to create much more distance between me and the bad guy, just out of pure fear for my life. And unless I had family members in the car I am not sure I would risk getting shot over my wallet and my car.

The 3 guys came up and surprised him, which means he let his guard or awareness down.. Maintaining awareness is hard to do at all times but I try to keep my awareness up as much as possible but it is tough. In this situation it seems he let his guard down a little.

On the flip side you can see him create space and position his hand on the gun before he drew it. And his reaction and draw of the gun is quick, precise and there is absolutely no thought process to it.. It is pure muscle memory

We talk alot about the emotions and aftermath of a shooting, in this case the officer may have to deal with a lot of emotions about taking the life of a 16yo, but we also talk about the fact that the officer didn't dictate this kids decisions... From reading the article this is no where near the kids first brush with the law, and by his actions the officer likely saved the life of someone else down the line.

We can all sit back and quess what we could, would or should have done, but the officer didn't do that.. He reacted on his training and it most likely saved his or the life of someone else

cwink wrote:Chances are the cop didn't know the kid was 16, the only thing he probably saw was the end of that barrel..

As I mentioned before I am not sure I would or could have acted as he did. I think I would have tried to create much more distance between me and the bad guy, just out of pure fear for my life. And unless I had family members in the car I am not sure I would risk getting shot over my wallet and my car.

The 3 guys came up and surprised him, which means he let his guard or awareness down.. Maintaining awareness is hard to do at all times but I try to keep my awareness up as much as possible but it is tough. In this situation it seems he let his guard down a little.

On the flip side you can see him create space and position his hand on the gun before he drew it. And his reaction and draw of the gun is quick, precise and there is absolutely no thought process to it.. It is pure muscle memory

We talk alot about the emotions and aftermath of a shooting, in this case the officer will more than likely have to deal with a lot of emotions about taking the life of a 16yo, but we also talk about the fact that the officer did not dictate this kids decisions... From reading the article this is no where near the kids first brush with the law, and by his actions the officer likely saved the life of someone else down the line.

We can all sit back and quess what we could, would or should have done, but the officer didn't do that.. He reacted on his training and it most likely saved his life and the life of someone else

Fixed it for ya'. Prayers to all involved.

Who cares how old the robber is! He was robbing the guy, took the risk and paid dearly for it.

hntrpat1 wrote:Who cares how old the robber is! He was robbing the guy, took the risk and paid dearly for it.

That is easy to say from behind a computer screen.. I would imagine it would be a lot harder to be standing over a 16 year old kid, or anybody for that matter as they lie on the ground moaning and screaming in pain while they are dying..

Lot's of people say. "Ahh I would just shoot them" One thing we try to stress in the classes is to avoid the confrontation if at all possible.. In this incident if if was anyone else besides this cop, they would probably have gotten shot too.. There are not too many people that CC that could pull that gun out that quick and get a shot off while someone else already has a gun pointed at you.. This cop was not only lucky but good..

I have been to scene where someone died from a gunshot, it is not something you will ever forget. There are alot of moral, ethical, emotional,and tactical reasons for avoiding a conflict if at all possible that we try to stress in our classes. Many of which most people don't think about before they pull the trigger..

From your take on it - Was the cop pretending to get his wallet out while drawing? What was the cop's left arm doing - distracting/blocking the other gun/other?

Bercy wrote:From your take on it - Was the cop pretending to get his wallet out while drawing? What was the cop's left arm doing - distracting/blocking the other gun/other?

If you watch closely he is pulling his wallet and keys out with his left hand and positioning his right hand on his gun.. This is a tactic that I started using lately. I started wearing my wallet on my left side so that I have my right hand free to draw if necessary..

My point about training is that the average CC person never practices drawing from a holster.. This is what irks me about "gun people" and there resistance to training. And if they were in this same situation would most likely have fumbled the draw and would have ended up getting shot themselves..


I tell all of my students the most important training tool is dry firing.. You don't want the first time you draw your gun from a holster to be when your life depends on it..

cwink wrote:If you watch closely he is pulling his wallet and keys out with his left hand and positioning his right hand on his gun..

Also note, that when he does draw, he lunges forward, deflecting the robbers gun and firing in one motion. It was a well executed move.

A good question to ask yourself before you carry, Am I prepared to shoot somebody even a teen ager that robs or threatens me..

Have your name, job, family put in the spotlight of A-Z.

Or just be remembered as a good guy, husband, father. That was mugged and stabbed in the lung or shot with his own gun..

get your life right with the man above, and show no mercy, cause you won't receive it. JMO

Big hand to the off duty cop.