DU Newsletter - A Call to Arms

[mallardchaser]

450,
as wildfowler once posted, what's a deer?

[sportsman450]

Aw come on Mallardchaser ,you know you wanted to watch the sunrise over a clear mountain stream with Jameson Parker in your arms.

$#!+!-I thought we were friends.
If I could do anything right now,I would be deer hunting,but I;m cripple right now.
You might want to try Green Ash.I heard it was reeeeeeeeeeal good.

Since you forget,deer are the challenging game.

[Stano]

I didn't acuse anybody of being a rich a-hole if directed at me you mis read I just posted a opion:::::sigh:::::: too easy to read too much in to printed type. Wildfowler seems like a nice fellow. A has and has not ain't got nothen to do with being a rich a-hole Im not a disgruntled poor sob out to battle the rich fellow. I have what I need to hunt the way I like etc etc. SO fellas I jest posted an opion :::sigh::: I didn't point any fingers or acuse anybody of anything. Just wanted to join the discusion!

I kinda thought the topic was DUCK RELATED tho?

Stano

[Wildfowler]

I'm not out to get anybody. I hope no one is out to get me. If I need to jump on the anti-du bandwagon, because it really is the right thing to do. Please, anyone, show me EXACTLY why I should jump on.

Thanks.

[MSDukDog]

Wow!! I was just looking for a BBQ to spend a Saturday when I came across the article.
Sorry, didn't mean to cause such a ruckus

[sportsman450]

Wildfowler-You are the voice of reason in this debate.You should form your own opinion.
As you know,my dislike of d.u. stems from a baaaaad experience while working as a volunteer.In my opinion,they have a use and discard attitude towards their free labor.I also believe they waste money.Maybe it's not much,but any is too much
They do seem to cater to the wealthier people.
Evedently,some still hold a grudge about the late season issue.I disagree with them,because it is not d.u.'s place to set season frameworks.(There is a group who believes they lobbied for a liberal season this year so they wouldn't look bad and lose revenues.) I don't know about that but it wouldn't surprise me.
Earlier you also said you had a bad experience as part of thier free labor force.
Whether or not this bothers you is up to you.
All that being said,they do help the ducks a little.
If I ever get involved again,it will be for Delta Waterfowl-they deserve at least a chance.

[MSDukDog]

Here is a link to non profit executive salaries:
http://nonprofit.about.com/gi/dynamic/offsite.htm?site=http://www.nptimes.com/Feb00/00salaries.html
This might put some of the discussion into perspective. I don't know what DU Execs are being paid but this seems to be the guideline.

[Wildfowler]

Yes Sportsman, I did say that I had a bad experience with them one time. I'm sure that everyone here has had a bad experience with DU in some form or fashion in their lives. Be it a personality clash between members, to a failed DU land project on someone's property.

All I am saying is that for me, I have decided not to hold the ducks accountable, simply because I had a bad experience. To me the ducks are far too important. And I know that DU does a good thing for the ducks. I have chosen put my petty differences behind me, for the greater good.

Sportsman, you of all people should be very clear on my intent by. All I am trying to do is get you or anyone else to please give me factual information that will validate these negative statement.

For example:

.(There is a group who believes they lobbied for a liberal season this year so they wouldn't look bad and lose revenues.)

Where did you hear this for the first time? And why do you believe it's true?

Please try to find evidence of this for me. I'm just not smart enough to put "two and two" together like the way you and other can so easily seem to do. For once, please give me a fact that can back up any of you negative comments.

They do seem to cater to the wealthier people.

One recent magazine article that I read in DU, talks about hunting tactics for large reservoirs. DU has printed tips and tactics for duck hunting on a budget. They are offering a new book called "Misery loves company" or something like that. This book shows a bunch of follies, that we regular duck hunters experience each season. There's an article this month called "Waterfowling the Susquehanna" That's public river hunting in Maryland.

There was an article called "hunting with a retriever". They offer tips and ideas on how to train your own retriever. How many rich doctors and lawyers try to train their own labs, versus the ones that go out and buy the 2500 professionally trained and started labs. They offer another section each month offering retriever advise.

DU is not "Grays Sporting Journal", where they talk about $50,000 African safaris. This is not English double gun, or what ever the heck is called. DU does not glamorize $80,000 shotguns. I've never seen a Barbour British expensive clothing advertisement in DU before. They don't advertise $400 Orvis waders.

DU advertises and caters to the exact thing that you and I are buying. Camouflage, Browning Gold hunter 3&1/2 magnums. Lacrosse waders. Robo ducks, Mossy oak. Avery floating gun cases. War Eagle boats. Remington pump shotguns. Winchester steel shot. Rich/N/Tone duck calls. 4 rivers layout boats. Flambeau decoys. Timberwolf "premium" chewing tobacco. Artic Cat. Columbia Sportswear.

The list goes on and on, these are the very things that you and I and the rest of us are buying. We are the ones who keep buying all of these goods and services that the evil "big duck business" keeps manufacturing. If WE collectively quit buying all of these products. There would not be any reason for new duck vendors to come on line. And the existing duck vendors would have to scale back their operations or go broke. Because the Rich doctors and lawyers are not buying the bulk of the goods and services from these profiteering companies. We are.

From my best estimation, 85 percent of the DU magazine caters you guys like you and I. I just simply cannot see the argument. If DU puts one article in each magazine that glamorizes some rich and powerful hunting lodge, you consider that as appealing to the rich and powerful? I don't.

I will concede that a small portion of what DU does, may be considered appealing to the rich and powerful. But most of what I see in this magazine is my mind is what the rich and powerful consider to be "beneath" them.

Why can't you site a specific example for me? I have given plenty of examples. Am I still missing something, if so, show it to me.

[eyeinthesky]

Wildfowler GREAT post. You put it in to a perspective that us good ole boys can see and understand. There are many organizations out there that cater not only to us but the rich folks also. The only difference is the rich boys may be willing to part with a larger chunk of change than us grass roots people and that is fine. But one thing not to forget is that DU and DW or any other organiztion for that fact would not be able to exist without the support and help from us hunters and rich folks. Yes I am a supporter of DU and what they have done to help North American waterfowl. I am also planning the Jackson DU dinner and hope that many of the members on this board can attend to help support DU and their efforts. If a DW dinner materializes, and I hope it does, I plan on attending it also and support them because we do need both organizations in order to better the life cycle of North American waterfowl. Mallardchaser I hope to see you at the dinner next week and hope the DW planning and organizing is coming along well for you. This is just my opinion, and opinions are like a**holes everyone has one.
Shoot em in the throat

[GulfCoast]

Hmmm, every lawyer that I know who hunts, including me, has trained their own dogs. I used to train with a couple of doctors. When my new pup gets here in a few weeks, I will start training then, too. Guess that means I ain't a "real lawyer" since I don't have a $2,500 starter dog. Oh well....

[judge jb]

GC, does that make you an "un-real lawyer?" i've been called an un-real judge........

judge jb

[Hambone]

Just to set the record straight - I'm not an elitist, just a little tired of attacks without facts. I don't think that how you make your living has any bearing on your ability as a duck hunter. I know some "rich doctors and lawyers" who can keep up with anybody out there. Likewise, I know some unemployed wannabees that couldn't call a spoonbill to a baited slough. I have a walmart boat. Wildfowler borrowed it from me one time after he punched a hole in his own. I hunt private land most of the time, but I have no problem with hunting public, either. I get a little fed up with the reverse snobbery - after all, when was duck hunting ever a bargain? I don't care where you hunt or how you do it - this sport is not cheap, and if you're that worried about money, hunt squirrels. DU gets money from all sorts of sources, and I don't perceive their show as somehow "catering to the rich" or "selling out" just because they hunt in fancy, high-dollar places. Like I said before, I like the show because it gives me a chance to see some places that I might not get to go otherwise. Back to an original point: I don't care if you like DU or not. That's your choice, and while I may not agree with you, I can respect your opinion. However, before you launch libelous attacks on any organization, gather the facts and make sure you are standing on the truth and not parroting the hearsay of others.

[Wildfowler]

Gulfcoast please know that I am not directing anything at you personally. I've never met you. But from what I have seen of you here in this community, I think you are a man of very high character. I consider you to be a regular duck hunter, just like the I am, and just like the rest of us here. We do what we do because we love doing it. You've gotten out there and done it yourself. You've learned, and worked at it, and you've become successful at it. I think that you and everyone else here are the very people that DU is catering to. The folks who buy the pre-trained dogs, are the very folks that the DU bashers are being critical of. I was merely stating my case that DU does not cater exclusively to that socio-economic class of hunter. I chose to use the term "rich doctors and lawyers" because that is how they are commonly referred to around this place. Please excuse my poor choice of words. Nothing ill was directed at you personally.

I think the people that the DU bashers are talking about are NOT the kind of people who care about reading tactics on how to become a successful hunter on public reservoirs, or rivers in the DU magazines. How many of the rich and powerful hunt public land regularly? Sure it does happen, but for the most part, the rich and powerful control the finest duck properties in this country. That's why these properties cost so much. Unfortunately, the one thing that "Big duck business" cannot make any more of, is duck land. The rich and powerful for the most part do not have the time, or want to learn how to train their own hunting retrievers. All I am saying is there seems to be no real merit to all the bashing, other than uninformed "bandwagon" by some.

And at the end of the day, after you filter through all of the muck and rhetoric, the bottom line is that the bashing cannot be good for the ducks. And I just don't understand how anyone who loves to duck hunt could possibly have this mentality. It just doesn't make sense to me.

If you don't want to support DU personally. That's fine. But on the other hand, I know how easily it is to believe all these negative opinions as if they were factual. I too stated that I did believe them at one time. And the bottom line is, promoting this type of negativity only has a negative impact on the ducks in the end. By doing so, we are holding the ducks accountable. Not DU.

I'm just trying to ask that we as a group, recognize that supporting the ducks is what we all need to be doing in some form or fashion. Be it through a donation to DU, DW, Delta Wildlife foundation, or any others that you know of. If someone can't donate, then please don't discourage someone else from donating without first having all the facts. Please, for the love of the ducks.

Thank you.

[torch]

DON'T ANY OF YOU THINK FOR A MOMENT THAT A CORPORATION AS LARGE AS DU DOESN'T DO A LITTLE ENRON OR WORLDCOM ACCOUNTING. HELL I CAN SHOW ON PAPER JUST ABOUT ANYTHING.

[Wildfowler]

If DU is defrauding the duck hunting community Torch. I'd sure like someone to prove it to me so I will quit sending them money.

Luckily, we all live in a coutry where you are presumed innocent, until proven guilty.