DuckSouth.com

goosebruce wrote:

If you look at hunt test breedings, and the lines they came from, you can buy the hottest lines in the country out of healthy dogs for a small % of the dough it takes to say who your daddy is. my 2 cents. travis

Or, you can dodge competetion...... {{{{{{{{ducking}}}}}}}

don't really know what thats supposed to mean. if you got something to say, go on and say it. travis

Wasn't directed necessarily at you. How did you take it?

goosebruce wrote: you can buy the hottest lines in the country out of healthy dogs for a small % of the dough it takes to say who your daddy is. my 2 cents. travis

Travis with me being a little slow , could you reword this where i can understand the point your making , ( the small % ) part mainly .

Well since you quoted me, why wouldn't i think you directed it at me? still dont know what it was supposed to me, so I figgered Id ask.

cc, you can buy a puppy out of nfc whoever x some dog and it cost x number of dollars. you can buy a puppy out of nfc whoevers son who happens to run hunt tests x a bitch who happens to run hunt tests but adds something to the mix for a small % of x number of dollars. Many times genetically the ht litter is better, and its always cheaper. Amazes me the shr or jh dogs bred to nfc dogs and people think the pups are worth 1500-2000 bucks. No way. You can buy well bred hunt test litters all day long, cheap, one generation removed (on both sides, not just one side) from nfc or national caliber level dogs. for 97% of the people in this world, its all the dog and breeding they need. And its a steal. travis

That exactly what I did Travis. Pop is a 5X GHRCH and Mom was a HR at the time (now HRCH and running the spring grand)..........and I didn't spend but $600........bargain any day. Now I've got an NFC grandpa on the top along with a GHRCH and a FC/AFC on the bottom along with a HRCH. I don't for one minute dismiss the grandparents or the titles, especially the NFC and FC. In fact, it makes the ped. if you ask me. Anything past that is not very instrumental to the pup, or has very little value.

My point in my comment above was that some will take the cheap route with dogs knowing they won't compete them at a high level. To me, it doesn't make sense to buy a pup with no FC in at least the first two gen's with the thoughts of competing at a high level of competetion, i.e.: Field Trials.

What's so wrong with discussing where your dogs came from? Hell, it's a very common question among dog folks everyday. And I would pay a few more bucks for a FC to bred to a GHRCH, especially if the FC held some hunt test titles as well. And it wouldn't be to just talk about it either. It would be to compete at a higher level. Get my statement now?

10-4 Travis ,,,,,,,,,,,i aggree and was able to understand it when you re-posted ............thanks CC

There is no cheap route. Hunt test breedings ARE the cheap route, thats what Im telling ya. You can buy kick ass hunt test bred pups all day long for 4,5,600 bucks. Thats not saying hunt tests are the end all to breeding programs.... its more like saying let someone else take the hit on a new car... and you can buy it 9 months later for 5k less. Get the lines you want, from hunt test parents, and there is no better bargin in dogs, period. With backyard breedings 250-500 bucks, more if they got block heads and otter tails (whutever the hell that means), a hunt test puppy is a bargin, nevermind allthe other ways people are sold puppys.

It pays to keep watch and look and see about dogs. The more you know, the more of a 'deal' you can slide in on. Like char chars mom, thats only a lowly hr dog (out of on the most potent dogs ever quik windstorm). shes got littermates running the grand and srs... shes only a lowly hr dog because of a divorcee took her out of training. The trainer liked the dogs so much, he pushed for the litter.... didnt take a lot of detective work to figger out that was going to be something special. Most Ive ever paid for a dog (actually I didnt pay it, but still), 800 bucks and on paper shes was worth a lot more. titles are wonderful barometers, but spending the time to find out about the dogs can put you a diamond in the rough. If every dog in a litter is titled, but one, that one is still genetically the same (assuming no problems). espirt of the woods is one the hottest studs in the country, but no titles to his name... how many people 10-20 years from now will think thats odd... and how smart does the first person that bred early to him and found out what he produces feel? not exactly a secret there, but when looking at a litter, find out about the parents siblings. Id rather bet on consistancy that the hero...

Everytime I hear about $3,000 puppies, I cringe. But I can at least SEE where someone thinks they are getting an edge with that. Its the middle of the road between big bucks and a bargin puppies I dont see. And I defiently dont get the nfc x jh with nothing to show for it but a utuers and a stud fee puppy. course I dont get the waiting 18 months to pay 1500 bucks for a birt dog either. Well bred puppies are simply cheap, and easy to come buy, for like I said, 97% of the dog world and there uses.

my dad can beat up your dad

I'll look for the article and post the link, but its got some REALLY cool information in there that was compiled by some horse and dog folks who studied something they call the 'maternal grandsire' phenomenon (or something to that effect) Basically, they say that there are more identifiable traits, both behavior and physical passed down by the maternal grandsire than any other relation in the pedigree. Thats some serious paraphrasing but you get the gist of it.

I've always thought the bitch brings more to the table than anything and I've heard some folks who have a lot more years and more important letters in front of their dogs name say the same thing.

i've got a dog w/ nothing in his pedigree and a dog that's got just about everything there is to have.......spent WWWWAAAY less on the no named dog.

if anyone would like to take this highpowered, middle finger waving jackazz off my hands so gauge and i can get back to biness, i'd be much obliged.

Gator...................gone huntin

p.s. what was the question

This is interesting. Pull up your ped on goDogInfo and a do a percent in Ped search for 10 generations back............Quite different from the 5 gen ped.

I had dog's pull up I didn't have a clue would influence my ped like they do. The ones from farther back appear because they were in the line multiple times. i.e.: Super Chief was in my Ped 37 times.

Anyway, just a few of interest and their pecent of influence......(in ped just once unless listed otherwise)

HRCH Blackwater Souie 50% (Dame)
5X GRHRCH Eba's Big Boss Man 50% (Sire)
FC-AFC Blackwater Rudy 25% (Grand Sire)
'98 NFC-AFC Abe's Ebony and Ivory 25% (Grand Sire)
2X NAFC - '68 NFC Super Chief 18.5% (37 times in ped)
FC-AFC Paha Sapa Chief II 13% (58 times in ped)
'93 NAFC-FC MD's Cotton Pick'n Cropper 12.5%
'77 NAFC-FC River Oaks Rascal 10.16% (8 times in ped)
'76 NFC-AFC San Joaquin Honcho 9.38% (5 times in ped)

and so on...........

Check it out with your dogs, it's good stuff!

BamaK9 wrote:I'll look for the article and post the link, but its got some REALLY cool information in there that was compiled by some horse and dog folks who studied something they call the 'maternal grandsire' phenomenon (or something to that effect) Basically, they say that there are more identifiable traits, both behavior and physical passed down by the maternal grandsire than any other relation in the pedigree. Thats some serious paraphrasing but you get the gist of it.

I've always thought the bitch brings more to the table than anything and I've heard some folks who have a lot more years and more important letters in front of their dogs name say the same thing.

Maternal Grandsire Phenomenon:

http://www.akc.org/breeders/resp_breedi ... ndsire.cfm

http://www.shiresusa.com/equus.htm

http://bridlepath.wordpress.com/2006/05 ... randsires/

Thanky sir, there it is, you are much less lazy than I am good sir!

GulfCoast wrote:

BamaK9 wrote:I'll look for the article and post the link, but its got some REALLY cool information in there that was compiled by some horse and dog folks who studied something they call the 'maternal grandsire' phenomenon (or something to that effect) Basically, they say that there are more identifiable traits, both behavior and physical passed down by the maternal grandsire than any other relation in the pedigree. Thats some serious paraphrasing but you get the gist of it.

I've always thought the bitch brings more to the table than anything and I've heard some folks who have a lot more years and more important letters in front of their dogs name say the same thing.

Maternal Grandsire Phenomenon:

http://www.akc.org/breeders/resp_breedi ... ndsire.cfm

http://www.shiresusa.com/equus.htm

http://bridlepath.wordpress.com/2006/05 ... randsires/

Not sure what all the titles mean, but here you go:
Ped for Risky Luck's Lady Lola
NAFC FC AFC-Ebonstars Lean Mac
FC AFC- Fordlands Bored Out Ford
HRCH- Dust Devil Desert Duk- MH
HRCH- Fin and Feathers Risky Blackjack
FC AFC- Websire Honest Abe
(3rd in Derby)- Bowmans Hedge Fund
FC AFC- Thunderhills Black Splash
FC AFC- Dare to Dream
FC- Running with the Devil
FC AFC- Trailcreek Blues Dacey
HRCH- Lost Creeks Lady Luck
FC AFC- Hilltops Hayseed
GRHRCH UH- Wolfcreeks First Yellow Elly- MH MNH
Waterfowl Beans N Beer CDX - MH