Arkansas votes ok on spinners

[dorf]

Was in Arkansas Monday mill manager mentioned Ark. voted to legalize spinners. I'm neutral on the subject been hunting ducks since 69 use them less than a dozen times. I have yet to learn how to blow a call well enough, so can see the benefit of spinners but the true belivers frown on them.

[cwink]

I think it would be easier to learn to blow a call than to drag one of them spinners to the woods...They may work, but aint worth the trouble to transport.

[GET-N-RITE]

Dorf you mean to tell me you have been duck hunting for almost 40 years and still can't work a call?

[dorf]

Didn't say I couldn't blow one, just not up to the higher standerds of my hunting partners. I have several calls my new RNT and I have along way to go.

[GET-N-RITE]

I'm just messn with bub

[olemissduckhunter]

was in macks the other day when the announcement went down......you talk about some pissed off people......everyone at the RNT shop was cussing the AGFC Commissioners

[Bonehead]

Didn't say I couldn't blow one, just not up to the higher standerds of my hunting partners. I have several calls my new RNT and I have along way to go.

What is up Dorf? Welcome to Duck South....Your boys JamesO and the crew are pretty discrimintating in their calling huh? I think we both know that when they will come, they will come.

Look forward to seeing you this fall if we have any water in the willow line

[oltcutdown]

Arkansas votes ok on spinners

No, you mean the Arkansas G&F Commissioners voted on spinners. Most folks I know, that know how to hunt ducks, in AR or anywhere else for that matter, did NOT want this. The hunting in AR was just starting to get back to normal. What I mean is, the last 3 years without the contraption, we have seen more big groups working a spread, and more big groups hitting the water. Now it's a freaking free for all, they are allowing 2 hens in the mallard limit, 3 woodies, and the damn spinners.

If you hunt public timber at all, every hole from Cardwell to Eudora will have a damn spinner in it. The old ducks will fall prey to this once or twice once they get there, from then on, you better not have a decoy or a spinner if you want to kill ducks. I'm surprised they didn't repeal the lead shot ban, might as well, cause they damn shure don't give two $#!+ about the hunting in AR. If they did, they would realize its the quality of the hunt and how you kill them, over how many you kill for the picture afterwards.

This breaks my heart. I thought AR had it figured out with banning guides on WMA's and the spinner ban. As bad as I hate to say this, you better be buying one if you want to compete on flight days. Past that, you better know when to cut it off as well. Carry on.

[Caller1]

The are back up to TWO hens also!!??

[D-2 Olt]

My letter to the AGFC, obviously it didn't mean $hit!

"Gentlemen-



Just a quick reflection of my thoughts on the ban on spinning wing decoys. Why would we even consider what other states do or don’t do? We are the duck hunting mecca of the world and if people don’t want to follow our direction or actions, then the hell with them. We undoubtedly have the finest waterfowling history of all the great states in this country and we owe it to our natural resources and our future generations to leave them in the best possible shape we can. If just one survey shows that these spinning wing decoys give a hunter an unfair advantage or makes juvenile ducks more susceptible to being killed, then it should be a no-brainer to keep the ban on these “gimmicks”. Conservation is the most important aspect and we should always err on the side of caution.



Thanks for all of your hard work. We all need to do our part in preserving this great sport!"

[Double R 2]

Enough of this BS already. The commisioners that voted this in ran contrary to the opinions of Arkansas' biologists and many, many ardent sportsmen. They're political hacks, what do you expect.

This entire robo fiasco will not cease until SOMEBODY takes FWS (Office of Migratory Birds, Specifically) to task: (1) makes them form a formal position statement on why they've turned a blind eye to a device that is contrary to independent studies from several states that subsequently maintain a ban on these devices; on why they've turned a blind eye on use of electronical decoying devices but a ban on other electronic (calling) devices; on why they've ignored a device that has been shown to effectively increase mortality of hatch-year birds where otherwise their entire cadre of rules is designed to constrain or moderate the overall take within a framework and harvest model, and - unless I'm missing something - why despite their mission statement of "working with others to conserve, protect and enhance fish, wildlife, and plants and their habitats for the continuing benefit of the American people" they have not in a DECADE done a single thing that qualifies as even remotely having objectively evaluated a device so percieved as the ruin of the American tradition of waterfowling as to create such extreme polarity among many U.S. hunters! (2) Legally challenge their (assuredly at this point) CONTRIVED statement on its technical merit. My point: forget the political hacks in Arkansas and the upper flyway council; ban the dammned things nation-wide or instigate a legal injunction for the period of years necessary to properly evaluate their role in our nation's decreased waterfowl.

Want ducks-limitless, less-skill trigger pulling nirvana? Go to South America while it lasts! Or, nearer home, to your local shooting preserve! Here in North America we're talking SIX measly little ducks, best-case scenario, in an era where hunter participation is at a 232-year low (excluding war-time). This hunting thing of ours doesn't need contraptions and gizmos; it needs skill and challenge, self-imposed handicaps of ducks paddle down over the decoys, greenheads only. Pursuant to this entire issue in its full context, I'm reminded of Nash Buckingham's fabled and beloved Beaver Dam Hunting Club: at a time preceding Migratory Game Bird laws, those gentlemen restrained themselves to FIFTY DRAKE ducks daily not because they HAD to, but because they were sportsmen. And just why is it that major leaguers use good old-fashioned wooden bats instead of aluminum? Now more than ever this waterfowling heritage of ours demands honor, for the resource and for the HUNT itself.

[Bonehead]

Enough of this BS already. The commisioners that voted this in ran contrary to the opinions of Arkansas' biologists and many, many ardent sportsmen. They're political hacks, what do you expect.

This entire robo fiasco will not cease until SOMEBODY takes FWS (Office of Migratory Birds, Specifically) to task: (1) makes them form a formal position statement on why they've turned a blind eye to a device that is contrary to independent studies from several states that subsequently maintain a ban on these devices; on why they've turned a blind eye on use of electronical decoying devices but a ban on other electronic (calling) devices; on why they've ignored a device that has been shown to effectively increase mortality of hatch-year birds where otherwise their entire cadre of rules is designed to constrain or moderate the overall take within a framework and harvest model, and - unless I'm missing something - why despite their mission statement of "working with others to conserve, protect and enhance fish, wildlife, and plants and their habitats for the continuing benefit of the American people" they have not in a DECADE done a single thing that qualifies as even remotely having objectively evaluated a device so percieved as the ruin of the American tradition of waterfowling as to create such extreme polarity among many U.S. hunters! (2) Legally challenge their (assuredly at this point) CONTRIVED statement on its technical merit. My point: forget the political hacks in Arkansas and the upper flyway council; ban the dammned things nation-wide or instigate a legal injunction for the period of years necessary to properly evaluate their role in our nation's decreased waterfowl.

Want ducks-limitless, less-skill trigger pulling nirvana? Go to South America while it lasts! Or, nearer home, to your local shooting preserve! Here in North America we're talking SIX measly little ducks, best-case scenario, in an era where hunter participation is at a 232-year low (excluding war-time). This hunting thing of ours doesn't need contraptions and gizmos; it needs skill and challenge, self-imposed handicaps of ducks paddle down over the decoys, greenheads only. Pursuant to this entire issue in its full context, I'm reminded of Nash Buckingham's fabled and beloved Beaver Dam Hunting Club: at a time preceding Migratory Game Bird laws, those gentlemen restrained themselves to FIFTY DRAKE ducks daily not because they HAD to, but because they were sportsmen. And just why is it that major leaguers use good old-fashioned wooden bats instead of aluminum? Now more than ever this waterfowling heritage of ours demands honor, for the resource and for the HUNT itself.

Good stuff Ramsey. Thanks

[70 sprig]

Arkansas votes ok on spinners

No, you mean the Arkansas G&F Commissioners voted on spinners. Most folks I know, that know how to hunt ducks, in AR or anywhere else for that matter, did NOT want this. The hunting in AR was just starting to get back to normal. What I mean is, the last 3 years without the contraption, we have seen more big groups working a spread, and more big groups hitting the water. Now it's a freaking free for all, they are allowing 2 hens in the mallard limit, 3 woodies, and the damn spinners.

If you hunt public timber at all, every hole from Cardwell to Eudora will have a damn spinner in it. The old ducks will fall prey to this once or twice once they get there, from then on, you better not have a decoy or a spinner if you want to kill ducks. I'm surprised they didn't repeal the lead shot ban, might as well, cause they damn shure don't give two *!@#@* about the hunting in AR. If they did, they would realize its the quality of the hunt and how you kill them, over how many you kill for the picture afterwards.

This breaks my heart. I thought AR had it figured out with banning guides on WMA's and the spinner ban. As bad as I hate to say this, you better be buying one if you want to compete on flight days. Past that, you better know when to cut it off as well. Carry on.

Olt , this " compete " thing is what I don't understand . I've been wackin ducks since I was strong enough to carry a shotgun , and I've never looked at it as a competition . I've figured out that no matter how hard I try I will never be able to kill'em all , so I quit tryin .

I enjoy killing out just as much as the next guy , but It ain't a race to me . Sometimes you can out call the robos , some times you can't . But on the mornings that the " circus " sets up too close to me , I usually just wait'em out . They'll prolly have to drag up by 8:30 so they can get their lazy azzes to the cafe' for some gravy and then to the house while the lighting is good for picture takin .

Then I'll get a chance to work ducks , I'd rather be out there with the ducks all morning anyway .
JMO of course , to each his own , but I refuse to hunt over one of the mofos . I hate it for you Arkies , wish missippi had the balls to give a ban a go .

[The Waterfowler]

Well, add me to the "Mad as Hell" list also. I feel like the good hunters were sold out. RR and I have a plan and details will come up as they arise. We will need support and will explain more later.

Now for the venting of my frustration: I agree that every hole in WMA's will have spinners, every duck hunting wantabe will be back in full force with their pacifier stuck up in the spread. The quality decoy shooting will go away much quicker than it came back, last year rivaled 1999-2000 for us, and we've never used one of the damn things on our club to start with. I've told myu members that if caught with one they're out, no discussion. What on God's green earth were the Commissioners thinking. Bring back Robos and 2 hens!! Why not form a possee and go to Canada next spring and stomp eggs? Watch how the cripple rate goes up from shots at marginal birds flaring from them. Here's the deal. With all the Robo friendly states north of us allowing them, what birds get to Arkansas will not be free of the gauntlet and the "Super-Hens" that made it here will be, in all probability, killed and another imprinted bird and the clutches she raises won't be around any more. At least Tennessee had the gonads to cut it to 1 hen! The Migratory Bird Treaty act outlawed live decoys, now technology has brought them back. I'd much rather shoot over bait as it saves wear and tear on the lungs blowing a call and lets you keep you hands warm while waiting for the next "Clay Pigeon". Lead shot, un-pluged guns, no shooting hours, etc. should be allowed also since the common sense of the MBTA is no longer in vogue. Why do you think out forefathers enacted this? To preserve the future for us to screw up? No, I think they wanted to pass on quality to the next generation which is something we should think about, I'm in the twilight of my life but am sad to think of how it will be when the Russell boy grow up or my two sons when they reach middle age, or everyones grandchildren for that matter. Will it be, "We used to kill ducks with Dad, but they didn't plan for the future." The dollar is controlling the resource puching for longer seasons, higher bags, and the American way of free enterprise to make a buck on another gimick without the thought of the impact it makes on our sport. Any of you that have been to Canada know how deadly these things are in the fields and how many brown ducks and juvies get killed with them. It's fun now, but it won't be for our kids IMO. Couple all this with the plowing of 4+ million acres of CRP and watch what happens in the next few years. I've lost count of how many trips I've made to Argentina and Mexico and even down there I refuse to let them put one out and likely as not I kill as many or even more than anyone else in our groups do. Bottom line, they aren't necessary!

Something has to be done and we're going to try.

[fireplug]

I aint trying to start a battle or a war.....just want your guys' honest opinions. Do you really think that the mojo's/robo's
really help that much? I have one and have used it, but it has been a long time. I never really saw where it improved
any kill numbers for me. Therefore not worth the hassle of carrying it in. Just wonder where it has been shown or proven
to help the kill numbers. If the juveniles are young and haven't learned the ropes yet, wouldn't they be just as easily persuaded
to drop in your decoys with a few good calls blown at them?

I understand your anger if you really feel they help anyone using them.....but from my experience I don't see where they help that much,... at least in the sad places that I hunt. Just my $0.02 Maybe the hill birds are smarter and not fooled as easy by them.

Now yall don't light into me bout using a dam spinner either.