Need Advice or info.....not trying to stir the pot.

[Forester]

Peewee, I don't really care to get involved in the DU vs Delta Waterfowl debate since I think they have both done great things for waterfowl. As for DU restoring wetlands through tree planting, I feel I must respond. I too am a forester and the trees planted by DU for the WRP program were in fact paid for by NRCS. DU administered the program and bought trees and lined up vendors to do the planting but they were reimbursed for their costs plus a pretty nice profit to boot from NRCS. While I havn't followed it too closely lately, in the early stages of DU's involvment in the reforestation efforts, they were charging NRCS $140 per acre to plant (seedlings plus planting costs). At the same time, there were quite a few tree planting vendors from as far away as Oregon that would do the same thing for about $100 per acre. These are '96 or so numbers so I'm sure things have changed since. With thousands of acres in MS, LA, and AR enrolled in WRP, DU did quite well. While it makes for good publicity to say "DU is restoring wetlands", I tend to believe it's just like the vacuum cleaner - it's all about the money.

[captain duck]

Memphisstockbroke Many years ago in the late 1970's when I was Hinds County(Jackson) sponsor chairmen I attended the state convention at the Biloxi Hilton on the coast. Changing the subject to the DU headquarters in Memphis, I have hunted 2-3 times with a regional director named Eldridge. Do you know him?

[ February 07, 2002: Message edited by: captain duck ]

[duforester]

Well, I feel we should support both organizations as well as do things on our own, such as planting and restoring areas for the ducks.

[feedcall]

I have to work and I have a family. I don't have time to plant trees and restore wetlands. DU is a large organization that I can pay to do that. Sure they built an incredible headquarters in Mem. and they may not always spend money to everyone's satisfaction, but they are running a large operation. They are expanded and need more money to expand more so they can do more wetland projects. I have seen many, many projects that DU has done right here in the Miss, delta in the last few years. I can think of about 7 or 8 camps right off the top of my head that have had thousands of acres restored or improved by DU. I don't think they are making land anymore, and cities aren't getting smaller so any wetlands restoration is good for my grandchildren. You say it is all about the money, I want to know what else it should about. Every community has chapters that you can join, be a part of, and build valuable relationships. Just because this past hunting season made some of us hunt harder doesn't mean DU is spending money in the wrong places. Lake Erie still isn't frozen. Any one that is an experienced ducker has seen the results of DU's work fall into your decoys plenty of times. I have fun at the banquets, and I will continue to support DU and Delta. They are doing things I wish I had time to. DU's presence in our society as a conservation group is essential to fighting people like Rosie and the Greenpeace movement. Our right to bear arms depends on our supporting DU,Delta, and any organization that supports the hunting industry and hunters.

[Hambone]

Feedcall, thanks for an eloquent and accurate comment on this "tar baby" of a debate. I have no way to know the big picture, but my own experience is that the most vocal critics spend nothing on DU, DW or developing/restoring wetlands or protecting waterfowl...they have plenty of criticism, but offer nothing to address problems. I am personally very aware of the expense involved with the management of several thousand acres in the Delta. When you consider what is involved when conservation is carried out on a national level, I almost wonder how these organizations accomplish all that they do for such a good price. If the critics think they can do a better job of protecting the ducks and their habitat, I say let them form their own organization, select their mission, raise the money it takes and put their plan into action. If their plans make sense, I would probably send them some money myself!

[RN989]

Now I jump in on the remark "that we have all seen the benefits of DU's work fall into our decoys".
Nope, false, wrong answer....
Duck hunting has been around much longer than DU or any other org. like it and will be long after they are gone. Never have I hunted a day in my life that I can attribute the sucess of that day to DU...(45 day season 3 birds per day and never seeing another single hunter). I would gladly take that back. I never thought it was that bad.
Thanks DU,

[Jeff]

Now when I am not interupted in mid post, I think there are problems with DU, I feel DU may even concede this. Some of the things I don't like are the heads of it making a lot of money. I feel like it can be run as a not for profit organization without the heads of it making a fortune. I also wonder how much money is really captured with some of their stuff like the adress labels you get a whole bunch, heck my dog has gotten them before somehow. How do you explain that one? There are a lot of things that they do that I don't feel help us. However on the other hand any land that they can save up north will help us in my opinion. So I give some money to them in support of this. Then Delta I feel does a lot of work up there to. I don't know that much about Delta, but donated to them last year for the first time and the at least send you a lot of info about what they are doing with your money w/ studies and stuff like that. I do like the fact that Delta is out to wipe out the preadator situation there. That seems like a logical stance that DU won't do because it may turn PETA and other tree hugging organizations against them. I think we can restore all the wetlands we want to and if there are more coons, foxes and coyotes than ducks we aint gonna have a good hatch. Just my opinion. I know it works that way with turkeys and can't see how it would be any different with ducks except easier for the predators to find them since they will be near water. Anyway the fact is that both organizations do give something to waterfowl that I can't do. I can't go to Canada or the Dakotas to help with this. To me that is how we will get more ducks. So I think we should donate to them. The organizations aren't perfect but are we?

[Delta Duck]

DU can't see the trees for the forest. The policy making folks at DU are all about getting to point B no matter what the $25 members want. As you can see their position on the Farm Bill bit them in the ass.

Those pipes are nice and all, but After seeing hard core data on preditor control and DU just dismissing it was wrong.

I think DU could have done a couple of nice prohunting articles in the magazine a couple of years ago when those anti-gun, anti-hunting, tree hugging, peta pushers that you voted for hambone were in the White House.

I think that is all I have to say about it.

[sondance]

Good post Forrester & DD. This is sort of getting loke the great robo debate of 01. I guess all are sort of dissapointed in the lack of birds this past season. My whole rub with DU I guess is I want them to support mine and your beliefs (hunting) Come out and make a stand. Dance with the one who brung ya. Don't pander to the anti's, PETA etc... Don't straddle the dang fence so you can solicit $$$ from both sides. That approach might produce more contributions but, it's just not ethical IMO. But you know what they say about opinions esp. mine [img]images/smiles/icon_wink.gif[/img]

[Hambone]

Delta Duck, all I asked for was some factual basis for your statements. If the best you can do is make a personal attack on me, it's pretty clear that you don't have any real information to back your position. You sure missed the mark when you connected me with the past administration and their anti-hunting etc...I have been voting for 21 years and have never voted for a democrat yet!

[Wildfowler]

I didn't know DU supported "anti-gun, anti-hunting, tree hugging, peta pushers". Can someone please document this "fact" for me. I'll be the first to admit that I don't know enough about either organization to know all of their fundamental beliefs. I doubt that DU has become an anti-hunting, anti-gun org. My gut belief is that DU would stand to loose too much if they lost all of the $25/year members, which they surely loose would if DU took a public support of anti-hunting and anti-gun issues. I am just thinking off of the top of my head here. I really don't have any facts, perhaps I am wrong about this. Will someone please show me these facts? Heck, I might even jump on the anti-DU bandwagon if these claims are proven to be true.

I think DU does a good job. But I'll admit that I was a little disappointed with them several years ago while I was attending college. I received a letter from DU asking me to volunteer my time and service. Frankly, I was excited about the thought of this because I knew that DU was about to break ground on several green-tree reservoirs in a NWR in my area. My thought was that I might get to volunteer to help out with some of this work and I would have really enjoyed that opportunity. So I sent in my letter, accepting the call to volunteer my service. Looking back on this event now, I can see that I must have been very naive to think that some college student would get to do something fun like that. In the end, all DU really wanted was for someone to go out and sell as many tickets as possible to the up and coming dinner banquet. Not quite what I had in mind, but I did it anyway.

Long story short, I don't believe DU is doing a bad job or that they have become some liberal minded org. that appeals to anti-hunters, but I welcome the notion of being proven wrong.

[Delta Duck]

Hambone,
That was a pretty low blow to say you supported those people. I'm glad to see you did not.
I have no use for any of the Clinton crew. They have zero moral fiber.

Please forgive me!!!

[sondance]

Wildfowler - DU has not said they do not support hunting. They haven't said that they do either. Hence the problem. You are correct they aren't a bad org.. They do a lot of good work in habitat restoration, which has to increase the duck population. I am just tired of the junk mail I get from every official DU product and irritated that they don't focus more on the hunting community. It just seems like a money thing.

[Duxnbux]

You mean to tell me that DU is using my donations to beef up y'alls private clubs by planting all these trees. I thought they were supposed to be helping the public, not making better hunting for these private clubs. Since my donations helped put these trees on your place shouldn't I be entitled to hunt there also. [img]images/smiles/icon_confused.gif[/img]

[Blackduck]

DU is a machine. The kind of machine that doesn't run on electricity or oil or diesel but one that runs on CASH. That is the bottom line. Of course that is no surprise to anyone. They need cash to print those nice magazines, put on elaborate events ect. You can't expect DU to always cater to farmers and hunters. The cash just isn't there. I'll never match a donation made by Winchester. Sometimes in the great search for money the smaller people get passed over. Is it pleasant-no.