Stupid question about bullets and calibers?

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Odis
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Stupid question about bullets and calibers?

Postby Odis » Wed Jun 07, 2017 10:14 pm

Ok, maybe this will start a small discussion. For several years my son and I shot a .243, for a while, prior to my son starting to hunt, I'd shot the 100 grain nosler partitions because I wanted an exit wound and knew I was shooting a somewhat light caliber, always had decent results, never lost an animal and got exits. Federal then began loading the Barnes triple shock 85 grain, made the switch and love them, after about 30 deer between me and my son (mostly him) and several pigs, we never recovered a bullet, never lost a deer, most were hit pretty good and very few went more than 10-15 yards (if that far), always got an exit and a little bit of blood but never really needed it to find the deer. Here's my quandry, after looking for a particular rifle chambered in .308 for years, I finally found it, pre-64 model 70 featherweight! It shoots great! Once I got the gun, I ordered some triple shocks for it because I'd had such good luck with them when shooting the .243. First deer I shot was a nice, old mature main frame 8 but had a bunch of stickers, 15 total points, he was just over 200 pounds, first shot was a bad one, quartering away at about 125 yards, he turned ran back to where he entered the plot but just before he got out of it I got a second shot into his left shoulder, I knew I'd hit him pretty hard but he didn't flinch stumble or anything. Got down looking for blood and after about 20 minutes, found a little but not much, deer was dead about 30 yards from the last shot. When I got him to camp, caped him out and boned out the hindquarters, back straps and quartered the shoulders, etc., and iced him down, a day or so later was unloading the meat at the processor, grabbed the right shoulder, low and behold, there was the bullet in the meat (never made it to the skin of the off shoulder), prior to the .308, we'd shot several with the .243, a lighter bullet and had an exit, thinking this was just an anomaly, continued using the same bullets in the .308, last year my son shot another buck with the .308, bodywise about the same sized deer as before, same result, no exit, perfectly mushroomed bullet in the meat of the off shoulder, also about (maybe 25 yards further) the same distance, I would have thought that bullet would have done its business and exited with -0-, nada problem, especially since a .243 with a lighter bullet (albeit faster) had done so well in the past, used for many deer at ranges from 50 to 200 +/- yards, thinking about switching to 165 sierra game kings, what do y'all think?
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Wildfowler
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Re: Stupid question about bullets and calibers?

Postby Wildfowler » Thu Jun 08, 2017 7:33 am

I personally don't believe the Barnes bullet is necessary or even ideal for Mississippi deer. I would look at a traditional lead core bullet like the sierra game king you mentioned if that's what you like.

I think you should consider trying the hornady superformance load using the SST bullet.

I've reloaded for 308 using both the 150 and 165 SST, and prefer the 165. The superformance load should be available in both bullet weights. I've shot more hogs than deer with the 165. On larger hogs, over 200 pounds when shot through the shoulder square on, I generally don't get find an exit wound but every one of them shot like that has dropped dead in their tracks. I've never not had an exit wound on Mississippi deer with that bullet, just haven't shot that many nor have I shot a large deer with it to know for sure. I could be a little biased because of no large deer.

I'm just going to guess about this because I really don't know but i'll bet you saw better results using Barnes bullets in your 243 because of the higher velocity of that lighter weight bullet cartridge which promoted more rapid expansion than a slower moving 30 caliber Barnes bullet would.

I don't know if factory ammunition is available, but if you want to use the Barnes bullet in your 308 look for a ammunition that uses the 130 grain Barnes which should give you more velocity and better expansion.

I have a 30 caliber wildcat chamber that I load the 130 Barnes non tipped Bullet that is dynamite on hogs.
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Re: Stupid question about bullets and calibers?

Postby country_20boy » Thu Jun 08, 2017 11:36 am

Since you found the .308 bullets in the deer, I'll assume they died, therefore it's hard to say the bullet didn't do it's job.... :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

But I do understand your frustration of not getting an exit. I'm really quite surprised you didn't get exits, but I'm thinking its more of an anomaly due to the angle of the shot and not the norm for a .308. Not sure what weight Barnes bullets your using in the .308, but the .243 is probably running 400-500 fps faster, which is a pretty big deal. I usually shy away from internet discussions about which bullet is best, because there is no answer that is right for everyone in every situation. It's hard to find a bullet that won't work well in a .308, other than FMJ. It just kills stuff.

I've had great luck with 150 gr SST in a 30-06 (very explosive and exits 60% of the time) and I've been pleased with 120 TTSX in a 7mm-08 (almost always exits), both cartridges being very similar to a .308, but those 2 bullets couldn't be more different in construction and performance, yet they both work very well when placed in the right spot. Shot placement above all else!!

If exit holes are important to you, I would keep shooting the Barnes and get 10 more deer under your belt with it before giving up on it. 2 deer isn't enough to pass judgment. You may also consider a lighter version of the Barnes. I've heard great things about the 130 gr version. I'm of the opinion that Barnes bullets work best above 3000 fps.
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Re: Stupid question about bullets and calibers?

Postby Gunslinger » Sun Jul 16, 2017 10:41 pm

I'd love to see a pic of the mature 8 with a bunch of stickers. I like bucks with character. I've shot whitetail, mule deer, and elk for the past 8 years with nothing but Barnes TTSX. Some factory, some hand loaded. Haven't lost one yet, knock on wood...
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Re: Stupid question about bullets and calibers?

Postby Odis » Sat Aug 26, 2017 8:30 am

This is him
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Odis
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Re: Stupid question about bullets and calibers?

Postby Odis » Sat Aug 26, 2017 8:37 am

This is the one my son shot last year
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Re: Stupid question about bullets and calibers?

Postby peewee » Sat Aug 26, 2017 3:06 pm

Dang fine bucks.
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Re: Stupid question about bullets and calibers?

Postby Odis » Sat Aug 26, 2017 5:35 pm

Thank you
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Re: Stupid question about bullets and calibers?

Postby Blackduck » Sun Aug 27, 2017 5:54 pm

I'd use a lighter .308 bullet to get more MV. I don't recall your bullet weight but a 180 gn bullet is probably moving along at 2500-2600. Shot placement is crucial to getting a blood trail. The higher up on the shoulder you shoot the deer the less it will bleed. Blood has to usually fill the chest cavity before bleeding will really be evident. If you slide it in on the lower third, behind the shoulder like an archer there is usually blood for days. Especially with a more frangible bullet such as the SST. Those are some big buck and a lot of mass to plow through.
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Re: Stupid question about bullets and calibers?

Postby cwink » Fri Dec 01, 2017 11:09 pm

The .243 Win in an 85 grain bullet is wicked on whitetail. The Main reason is because "speed kills" . The. 243 is a necked down .308 and is pushing an 85 grain bullet about 3300 fps which nor only provides more penetration but also starts getting into hydrostatic shock territory.

Google hydrostatic shock and 220 Swift!
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Re: Stupid question about bullets and calibers?

Postby lefthorn » Tue Dec 05, 2017 9:58 pm

Like stated before, speed kills. This is especially true cor. Arnes bullets. You should shoot light for caliber bullets. I reload my own and want them going over 3,000 fps. The faster the better. For 308, you want a 110 grain or 130 grain
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Re: Stupid question about bullets and calibers?

Postby Wildfowler » Wed Dec 06, 2017 5:29 pm

Are you reloading a 130 grain bullet to 3000 ft./s? What bullet are using and what is the barrel length, recipe for load, etc.?

Thanks.

My go to load that I think I listed above is a 165 grain SST at about 2750 ft./s and it knocks them down really good.

I shot a deer not too long ago that somehow it looked like it flipped over frontwards and landed flat on its back. I have no idea how it happened but I was impressed with that load.
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Odis
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Re: Stupid question about bullets and calibers?

Postby Odis » Thu Dec 07, 2017 7:45 am

Sorry, I failed to mention the size bulllets, they were 150 grain TTSX loaded from Barnes, I don’t handload and was trying to get the lightest I thought they loaded, killed a pig with them the other day, worked fine, after the box is out will either see if I can find some lighter bullets or just go with something else
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Re: Stupid question about bullets and calibers?

Postby lefthorn » Thu Dec 07, 2017 9:33 pm

I load a 150 grain for my 300 wsm. Using 61 grains of RL 15. Getting about 3,150 fps
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Re: Stupid question about bullets and calibers?

Postby lefthorn » Thu Dec 07, 2017 9:35 pm

Go to Barnesblets.com. On top right, click lines and at bottom click load data. You can get their load data for their bullets. For 308, all of their 130 grain loads start close to 3,000 fps and go up

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