Initiative 42

[rjohnson]

Can someone please give a non-biased explanation of this controversy? I'm confused as to what it will actually change and accomplish. This may turn into a debate but hopefully it can help me and others understand it better since we will have to vote on it soon.

[Seymore]

This is how I understand it. Education has been underfunded for years. Mississippi is one of only a few states if not the only states that does not have an amendment to the state constitution mandating adequate funding for education. A group of citizens got together and pushed a petition campaign to have an amendment to the constitution mandating adequate funding. Legislature didn't take to kindly to anybody or any group messing with their ability to put money where they wanted and in what amounts so they came up with another amendment to put opposite 42 on the ballet. The wording of the two are so close that many could easily be confused. The key difference is 42 says education shall be fully funded while the legislature goes the long way around to say thing will remain status qua. It does nothing other than say they fully "support" education which is not the same as fully fund. The two went back and forth in the courts over wording and titles and it has now shifted to a public campaign to confuse the public. The legislature side is saying it puts all the power over disputes into the hands of the Chancery Judge of Hinds County which it doesn't. That's just the first stop as it can be appealed from there. 42 says if education is fully funded than any parent can bring suit to force that funding.

My personal thoughts on the matter revolve around two past incidents in this state regarding education; sales tax and casinos. I remember when the sales tax went from 5 cents to 6 cents and that extra penny was supposed to fund mandated kindergarten. When the time came the money wasn't there because the legislature had spent it. When casinos were put in the selling point was that the tax revenue would fund education and we would have so much money going to education that Mississippi would be the envy of the nation. That didn't happen either. So I don't really think the third time will be the charm.

This is all just how I've put the different pieces I've heard and read together. I may be completely out in left field and if I am somebody please step up and tell me where I rode off the reservation. As of right now I intend to vote for 42 unless shown why I shouldn't.

[Smoke68]

Who determines what "fully funded" means? I just know that throwing money at education solves NOTHING. We have big problems with regard to school district size and top-heaviness of administration. I have a big problem with the fact that a teacher pretty much can't be fired for poor performance. There are so many hoops to jump through, it's crazy and pretty much can't be done after they've been teaching for a short time period (6-12 months? Not sure, but it's a year tops).

So I guess I'm saying that schools in general need a lot of adjustment financially. That's not going to happen if the state is obligated to "fully fund" every year no matter what.

I respect Seymore's point, though. When you say you're going to do something with a new tax, it better be written in stone. Shoot, just look at the Ponzi scheme known as social security.

[fireplug]

[landscaper]

I'm sort of in the dark too but have been trying to research over the last couple of days and I still have a pile of question.

I don't see the word "fund" in 42 but some language about supporting "adequate" education. What does "adequate" mean? Bare minimum? Is what passes for adequate in my school system the same as what passes for adequate in yours? Is adequate for you child adequate for mine?

I don't see where it gives the power to challenge funding, curriculum, etc to parents. The language seems to give that power to "children". Do "children" have the discernment to handle that power?

Why do 4 Hinds COUNTY chancery judges get to make decisions for Alcorn county, Desoto county, or Washington county, etc? I can't site instances but it is my understanding that certain part of the state are already largely overlooked when it comes the disbursement of funding. What is to stop that from continuing and boosting some school systems while burdening others?

Where does the 1.9 billion dollars (or whatever the number was that I read) come from? Aren't we already robbing the education system to fund the rest of this underfunded state? (as earlier stated about the tax increases of the past and the casino revenue) And, how much will it cost to implement and enforce this? What's the added cost of examining each case and the months if not years they could bounce around in the system between county courts and the legislature?

Those are just a few...

If someone can show me the safe full of cash we forgot about in Jackson and prove that 42 will force state legislature to appropriately disburse it to school systems across the state, I'm in. Otherwise, this sounds like a bunch of ineffective bureaucracy that hands too much power over important decisions that effect our children's education to a few officials and to the kids themselves. I want it to be the cure-all but I don't see it. I'd love for someone to 'splain.

[fireplug]

http://www.sos.ms.gov/Initiatives/Initi ... tition.pdf

Hinds county judges will make the decisions. Not a good idea.

Common core is why I send my kids to private school. Give the school system over to those skillet heads in Jackson and you can
forever count me and mine out of the public education system. I'll render unto Cesar what is Cesar's but I won't let my kids be
indoctrinated by a miserably failing school system.

[MrGoodtime]

[rjohnson]

To say teachers can't and usually aren't fired is not true. In Rankin County they won't necessarily fire a teacher but the teacher usually resigns from administrative pressure. In the past few years the amount of time spent planning by the teachers, training for teachers, and overall higher standards of professionalism being required on top of more paperwork the teachers are being forced to become better teachers (or at least put in the effort to be) or get out. My wife worked as an interventionist last year and is a literacy coach this year. I have seen and heard more changes going on in the past three years than any other time of her 10 year teaching career through her daily ramblings about it. Now that doesn't necessarily mean children are advancing as fast as the teachers but teachers who are not getting on board are being forced into improvement plans and either getting on board or taking their lazy butts to the house without a job. I know of two teachers that were a year or two from retirement that were put on improvement plans because they just wanted to ride it out and cruise on easily until retirement. They were pissed but got on board and learned the new ways they were being required to teach.

Anyway back to 42 I have heard all the rhetoric above ad nauseam. I still don't know the truth however and continue to be confused. My wife is passionate about her job and career so I tend to lean on the side of getting them any help possible in funding but I'm not sure about giving judges the authority to force fully funding. What happens if we have another recession and state revenues are down 10%??? Education is fully funded and all other services have to take a say 25% cut instead of a 15% across the board including education. If it is set to grow at a certain amount per year to phase in fully funded and then grow a certain amount per year for COL increase and such then it could put a hurt on our state's finances if it is exempt. And a judge can't force it to be lowered like the legislature in times of financial crisis. It's a tough subject for sure. I just want the actual facts about 42 which seem to be biased depending on who you talk to.

[rebelduckaholic]

Both parents have been teachers and have either retired or fixing to retire. They say vote no. No reason to let a judge in one county appropriate the funds

[BBR12]

Planned Parenthood put a whole bunch of money into supporting 42. That is all I needed to hear. 42 gives the power of the legislature over to a hinds county judge. That is all I needed to hear.

If we don't like the way education is funded now you can call your legislature, If 42 passes try calling a hinds county judge.

[bigoak]

I'm voting against 42. Don't know where the numbers came from but there was a guest on supertalk who said the top ten performing high schools in the state spend on average $2,000 less per student per year than the bottom ten performing schools. Read that again and let it sink in. Throwing more money at a bunch of corrupt school districts is not the answer.

Millions could be saved by consolidating school districts and reducing administrative costs.

Millions could be saved by pooling buying power for school supplies.

Millions could be saved if there was more oversight of the bidding and contract process for major building projects at schools.

Make the schools have the same coach to player ratio as the teacher to student ratio. No need to have 10 football coaches for 70 players (1 coach per 7 players) when the classroom ratio is 1 teacher per 24 students. Require all coaches to teach classes.

The list goes on and on about ways schools waste money and we want to give these school districts more money? Vote no on 42.

[Seymore]

Weeeelllll.........Guess it's to late to get a 3rd option on the ballot. What about charter schools? There was a bunch of talk about those a year or so ago.

[Wildfowler]

Does anyone know where a copy of a sample ballot can be viewed online so we can read this ahead of time for ourselves?

Thanks

[Seymore]

The schools where my kids go have support 42 signs in front of the schools. Girls and wife came home from football game two or three Fridays ago with 42 stickers that were being handed out. It is sure giving the impression that at least this school district is supporting it. Here's a link I found that gives pros and cons of each. I understand now there is a third option on the ballot and that is that neither amendment is supported.

http://ballotpedia.org/Mississippi_Publ ... e_42_(2015)

[msbigdawg1234]

I can only say this,with all the corruption in school districts state wide , the top heavy admin, teacher student ratio where there are coaches that ONLY coach so on and so on . You put all the money in the hands of one hinds county judge you just wait and see where the most money goes. Ill tell ya first hand from hearing it everyday no matter how much money schools get if PARENTS don't get off their booty and start working and helping with these kids at younger ages ,the state will stay behind as a whole. There are so many kids coming into K classes that don't know how to count to 5 or even know the letter their name starts with and that is the truth. From learning skills to respect its gone in the toilet and it all starts at HOME. I can say on a good note that the VWSD is implementing some great things for these kids . We have started a new school of innovation its not for everyone , project based type learning that is posed to migrate to the HS. My child loves it. with the tracks that will be added for these kids to take her class will be the first kids that have the opportunity to graduate with an associates degree. I would hate to see funding get lop sided and screw this up and other programs state wide the districts are implementing for the benefit of the kids. But if there is not a push to get parents more active with their kids education it will be all for nothing. But back to question at hand I say NO to 42 with out knowing what this other option is all about